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Processed food market size hits $2.5b

Industry people say at food processors’ fair in Dhaka

Indian food processing machinery manufacturers are eying good business in Bangladesh as the latter’s agro food processing industry is thriving with each passing year. 

Annual sales of processed agricultural food amounts to around $2.5 billion with growth averaging 8 percent for the past 10 years as local consumption is growing, according to industry insiders.     

Around 70 Indian companies are taking part in a three-day “7th BAPA FoodPro International Expo 2019” at International Convention City Bashundhara.

Saif Ali Sayed, sales engineer at the Lithotech Food and Spice Machinery, said they have over 40 clients in Bangladesh, most of whom were expanding production.

“So the companies are purchasing machinery and equipment from our company,” he claimed.


Rahul Kothari, director of Pakona Engineers of Mumbai, has been taking part in the fair for the past five years. He said they supplied packaging machines to big food processors in Bangladesh including Pran, BD Food and Olympic.

Besides, the number of clients are increasing every year, he said.

Agro processors say export of their food products would cross the $1 billion mark by 2021 and the country has bright prospects in the sector.

“We are on way to increase our export from agro-processed foods thanks to government support and initiatives,” said AFM Fakhrul Islam Munshi, president of Bangladesh Agro-Processors’ Association (Bapa), while addressing the fair’s launching.

He said the size of the processed food market now stands at around $2.5 billion.

Bapa consists of 300 members who shipped around $400 million-worth products last fiscal year. According to Bapa, Bangladesh exports agro-processed foods to 144 countries.

Bapa and the Rainbow Exhibition & Event Management Services jointly organised the fair where agro and food-processing machinery are being displayed to familiarise local food processors with modern technologies.

A total of 300 companies from home and abroad are participating in the show that would remain open to visitors from 11:00am to 7:00pm.

Addressing the programme, Agriculture Minister Abdur Razzak said the government would purchase six lakh metric tonnes of paddy directly from farmers this Aman season. He said the authorities were preparing a farmers’ list up to the union level for a lottery so that none gets deprived.

Razzak assured cooperating with the agro processors to boost export.

Presided over by Ahsan Khan Chowdhury, chairman of the fair committee, the event had speakers including Bishwadip Dey, acting Indian high commissioner to Bangladesh, Syeda Sarwar Jahan, chairman of Bangladesh Food Safety Authority, Robert Douglas Simon, country representative of the Food and Agriculture Organization, and FH Ansary, managing director of ACI Agribusiness.

Vegetable exports rebound after four years

Sohel Parvez…….

Fresh fruits and vegetables export bounced back in fiscal 2018-19, ending four straight years of slump, thanks to higher demand and efforts to improve farming and packaging practices in order to produce and ship disease-free crops.  

Shipment of fresh produce, including potato, rose 31 percent year-on-year to $105.39 million in the last fiscal year, according to the Export Promotion Bureau (EPB).

In volume, exports of vegetables also soared, showed data compiled by the Plant Quarantine Wing of the Department of Agricultural Extension. Exporters shipped 17,487 tonnes of domestically grown vegetables, up 18 percent year-on-year.

Mohammed Monsur, general secretary of the Bangladesh Fruits Vegetables & Allied Products Exporters’ Association (BFVAPEA), attributed the reopening of exports to Europe in the last 7-8 months following a self-imposed ban by Bangladesh for almost two years for the rebound. 

Bangladesh is now shipping fresh produce by packaging them at the central packing house following guidelines for exports to the EU destinations, he said.  

“It has improved our compliance a lot and our shipment has increased.” 

The Middle Eastern countries, home to more than five million Bangladeshi migrant workers, are the biggest destination for the vegetables and fruits grown in the country, followed by Europe.

But the shipment to Europe had come to a halt after the government voluntarily imposed the ban on the exports a couple of years ago in the face of repeated detection of pest in the consignment from Bangladesh by the regulators in the EU. 

The UK, Italy, Germany and France are the major markets for locally grown vegetables and fruits because of the demand from Bangladeshi migrants living there.

Monsur said the government had slapped the export restriction to avoid any potential import ban by the EU. 

“It has paid off. We all have become more aware about quality standards and requirements for exporting,” he said, adding that orders from Qatar have gone up in the recent months.

Previously, exporters used to ship vegetables after packaging them on their own. Now every consignment is packed at the central packing house after quality check. There the consignment is sealed before directly going to the port for shipment.

Non-compliance notification from the EU has reduced significantly, said Md Azhar Ali, director of the Plant Quarantine Wing. 

“Overall, cultivation of exportable vegetables has expanded because of our extension work and training imparted to farmers on good farming practices to produce safe food,” he said.   

Hortex Foundation estimates that 46,476 tonnes of fruits and vegetables were exported in 2018-19, up 15 percent from the previous year, said Mitul Kumar Saha, assistant general manager of the state-run agency.

There has been improvement in post-harvest management and production quality as the government has carried out various projects in this regard, he said.

Despite the recovery, exports receipts remained less than half of the record receipts registered in fiscal 2013-14. Exporters had fetched $248 million from shipping vegetables, fruits and cut flower and foliage in the year, EPB data showed.

BFVAPEA President SM Jahangir Hossain said exports would have increased further if they could get cargo space on the Dhaka-London flights of Biman Bangladesh Airlines. 

Exporters used to get such space on the Biman flights in the past.

He said the association has raised awareness among farmers about the production of exportable vegetables and fruits, biological control, application of pesticide and pre-harvest intervals before harvesting.  

“As a result, farmers are getting higher value for their produce while local consumers have also benefitted from quality fresh crops,” he said.

Exporters source vegetables from areas around Dhaka city, namely Narsingdhi, Sonargaon, Gazipur, Sylhet, Khulna, Rajshahi, and Tangail.

Hossain expects shipment to increase in the current fiscal year. “We will be able to hit our export target if we get cargo space on Biman flights.”

Korea keen to invest in 10 PPP projects

 Munima Sultana ……..

Korea has shown interest to invest in 10 public-private partnership (PPP) projects in the aviation, rail and power sectors under government-to-government arrangements.

However, Bangladesh sought investment in 14 projects in the rail, road, power and textile sectors at the first Bangladesh-Korea joint platform meeting held in Seoul last month.

Sources said public and private delegates placed their proposals during the meeting.

“We have discussed all the projects during the meeting to explore the possibilities and find difficulties in implementing them under PPP,” said an official of PPP Authority who attended the meeting.

He said the two sides are expected to finalise the projects within next two or three months.

Under the Bangladesh-Korea joint platform, the delegates held one-to-one meetings on the projects proposed by different agencies such as Bangladesh Railway, Roads and Highways Department, Power Grid Company Bangladesh Limited, Narayanganj City Corporation and Bangladesh Textile Mills Corporation.

The meeting was a follow-up to the memorandum of understanding signed between the PPP Authority and the Korean government in April in Dhaka.

The PPP Authority and Korea Overseas Infrastructure and Urban Development Corporation (KIND) hosted the meeting.

The PPPA officials said the meeting mainly focused on the projects which could be implemented speedily after getting approval from the cabinet committee on economic affairs.

Korean companies which attended the meeting showed good interest in their proposed projects as they are working in Bangladesh either with different partners or under different projects, they added.

The Korean side showed interest in the projects including Bhanga-Payra port railway project of BR, light rapid transit project of Narayanganj City Corporation, East-West Elevated Expressway project of Bangladesh Bridge Authority and Khan Jahan Ali airport project of Civil Aviation Authority and Chattogram Bay Terminal development project of Chattogram Port Authority.

Besides, they were interested in four projects of Power Grid Company of Bangladesh and one each project of Bangladesh Power Development Board and Dhaka Power Distribution Company.

At the meeting, RHD proposed two expressway projects on Dhaka-Mymensingh Highway and Tongi-Pachdona Road while Bangladesh Textile Mills Corporation proposed four mills development projects.

BR sought Korean investment in building circular railway around Dhaka, construction of railway building in Chattogram and development of some railway hospitals.

Power Grid Company of Bangladesh placed its two projects–Raojan-Mirsarai 230kv transmission line and Matarbari-Banshkhali-Madunaghat 400kv transmission line.

Tk 51.5b project taken for Pyra Port

 FHM Humayan Kabir …..

The government is going to build one of the biggest multipurpose terminals of the country at the Pyra Seaport with the financial support of India, officials said on Friday.

They also said the Pyra Port Authority (PPA) has taken up a project at a cost of Tk 51.50 billion, where Tk 44.02 billion will come from the Indian Line of Credit (LoC).

The berthing length of the multipurpose terminal will be 1,200 metres, they added.

According to the PPA officials, the terminal will be mainly used for handling general cargo, sand and aggregate, and grains.

The terminal’s three berths with a length of 550 metres will be used for handling general cargo, two berths with a length of 400 metres for handling sand and aggregate, and one berth with a length of 250 metres for handling grains.

“We have already sent the Tk 51.50-billion cost project proposal to the Planning Commission for getting approval. Construction of the multipurpose terminal is expected to be completed by 2022,” said an official.

He also said of the total cost, Tk 44.02 billion will come from the US$ 4.50 billion Indian LoC-III.

The official claimed that Pyra, the third seaport of Bangladesh, will be the largest one by 2028 in terms of handling cargoes. It will annually operate about 3.0 million twenty-foot equivalent units (TEUs) of containers then.

During that time, the Chittagong Port will handle 2.23 million TEUs, and the Mongla Port will handle 46,000 TEUs, he noted.

According to the project proposal, the PPA will complete construction of a 1,200 metre X 22 metre jetty with necessary facilities, 10-kilometre (km) slop protection work, installation of 10-km 33-kv electricity line, setting up 10-km optical-fibre cables, building a water treatment plant, fixing a 2.4-km gantry crane, and some other works.

Another official said they have a target to make the Pyra Port operational by 2023.

“In addition to the proposed terminal, we also have a plan to construct another 650-metre length multipurpose terminal-1 at the northern part of the seaport in near future.”

“Indian government has already expressed interest to use the Pyra Port for its northern states. Besides, three big coal-fired power plants and two liquefied natural gas (LNG) terminals will also be set up in Pyra area. They will also use the port to handle their coal and LNG.”

“So, the port will be a busy hub in near future,” he added.

Currently, Chittagong is the largest seaport of Bangladesh, which is handling some 80 per cent of the country’s foreign trade.

The government is also trying to make Mongla, the second largest port, vibrant by upgrading its capacity.

Govt to do everything for dev of medical science: PM

Putting emphasis on advancing the country’s medical science further, Prime Minister Sheikh Hasina has said her government will do whatever is necessary for the development of the field, reports BSS.

“We want to do everything necessary for the development of medical science as well as education and higher education including sending teachers and other concerned abroad,” she said.

Sheikh Hasina added: “We’ll have to pursue all sorts of education so we can do more critical works like successful operation of conjoined twins – Rabeya and Rukaya – in our country.”

The Prime Minister said this when the medical team comprising Bangladeshi and Hungarian doctors and other staff who carried out the operation of the conjoined twins at the CMH in Dhaka recently called on her at her official Ganobhaban residence on Friday evening.

Sheikh Hasina said the Bangladeshi physicians gathered a huge experience through the surgery of conjoined twins titled “Operation Freedom”. “Now we’ll have to focus on further development of medical science by retaining this success,” she said.

Director General of Armed Forces Medical Services Major General Md Fashiur Rahman, Colsuntant Surgeon General of DGMS Major General Mahbubur Rahman, Dr Habibe Milllat, MP, Dr Csapody, the leader of the Hungarian medical team and its members Dr Csoky and Dr Pataki and other physicians and staff who took part in the operation spoke at the function.

Besides, Rabeya and Rukaya’s father Rafikul Islam also spoke at the function expressing his feelings about the successful surgery of her twin daughters.

Sheikh Hasina congratulated the physicians, nurses and other staff including the members of the Hungarian medical team for conducting the operation successfully.

“It’s a wonderful job of the Bangladeshi and Hungarian doctors,” she said, hoping that the twin kids would return to their mother’s lap with full recovery soon.

Through the successful surgery, she said, the physicians of the government institutions of Bangladesh gathered a new experience.

“A beautiful relation has been created among different hospitals and medical institutions centring the critical operation,” she said.

Praising the coordinated work of the physicians of those hospitals and institutions, the prime minister said these institutions worked together and developed understanding and exchanged experiences through it.

“You’ve separated the conjoined head of Rabeya and Rukaya through a successful surgery. But they’ve engaged you in a coordinated work and it’s a great achievement for all,” she said.

The prime minister said the medical institutions which were involved in the surgery of the conjoined twins will have to be more developed and modernised in the light of their experience.

Sheikh Hasina elaborated her government’s steps for development medical science and said the country’s first medical university was established during the Awami League government.

Govt considers LNG buy from spot mkt

M Azizur Rahman …..

State-run Rupantarita Prakritik Gas Company Ltd has initiated master sales agreements (MSAs) with 17 global suppliers separately to source liquefied natural gas (LNG) from spot market.

Final deals will be signed soon following the approval from the cabinet committee on economic affairs, a senior company official told the FE.

He said the Energy and Mineral Resources Division under the Ministry of Power, Energy and Mineral Resources (MPEMR) has already decided, in principle, to import around one-fourth of the country’s total LNG requirement from the spot market to reap the benefit of falling prices.

Spot market is a public market in which financial instruments or commodities are traded for immediate delivery.

Spot market for the LNG was developed over the past several years with the gluts of LNG output alongside the growth of emerging markets for LNG (liquefied natural gas).

Market insiders said the Platts JKM, which represents the prices of spot cargoes delivered to northeast Asia, averaged around $4.93 per MMBtu (million British thermal unit) in the second quarter of 2019, down from $8.26 per Mmbtu a year ago.

However, state-run Petrobangla has been importing LNG under term deals within the range of around $8.5 per Mmbtu to $10 per Mmbtu over the past one year since April 24, 2018, when the first shipment reached Moheshkhali Island in the Bay of Bengal.

The imported LNG is re-gasified at FSRUs (floating, storage, re-gasification units) before it is added to the national grid for use by end users.

Officials said the 17 interested LNG suppliers have been selected following a competitive bidding.

They will provide fuel to the country’s LNG-receiving terminals from the spot market following instructions time to time, based on demand, said the officials referring to some features of the initials.

The RPGCL would initially make proposal to the selected firms specifying the quantity of spot LNG for supplying to the LNG terminals.

It would seek to purchase LNG from the selected firms under the final MSA.

The imported spot LNG should have a gross heating value ranging from 1,025 to 1,100 Btu per standard cubic feet (scf).

The imported spot LNG would require to be blended with locally-produced natural gas, which is sulfur-free and sweet gas, before it is delivered to the end-user.

The imported LNG’s sulfur content could be low as a result.

The selected firms would have to supply LNG on a delivered ex-ship basis and the vessel size should range from 125,000 cubic metre to 220,000 cubic metre.

The RPGCL will procure spot LNG based on market prices, terminal availability, increased re-gasification capacity and downstream demand.

Currently, two FSRUs, owned by US-based Excelerate Energy and local Summit Group, are currently re-gasifying around 580 mmcfd of LNG.

Both the FSRUs have the capacity to re-gasify around 1,000 mmcfd of LNG in total, said a senior Petrobangla official.

Dhaka wants to host C’wealth business conference in 2020

Bangladesh wants to host a Commonwealth business conference early next year.

State Minister for Foreign Affairs Md Shahriar Alam has proposed to host the ‘Commonwealth Business-to-business Connectivity’ conference in Dhaka in the first quarter of 2020, reports bdnews24.com

Shahriar Alam said Bangladesh wants to host the event as the lead country within the Commonwealth for entrepreneurs and businesses.

He placed the proposal at a Commonwealth ministerial in London recently.

He placed several proposals at the Commonwealth foreign affairs ministers meeting (CFAMM) at Marlborough House, according to the Bangladesh High Commission.

The UK, Chair-in-Office of the Commonwealth, hosted the 18th CFAMM, a special meeting marking the 70th founding anniversary as it embarks on a historic reform process.

The state minister headed a six-member Bangladesh delegation at the meeting.

Shahriar Alam outlined Bangladesh’s plan to launch a virtual hub for connecting business, trade and policy making bodies for both documentation and showcasing business opportunities across the Commonwealth.

He urged the Commo-nwealth member states to share their business and trade information to help enrich the proposed virtual platform.

Shahriar also conveyed plans to make a special publication on the occasion of the proposed business conference.


Aiding foreign currency repatriation Planning minister backs VAT waiver on indentors

Planning Minister M A Mannan has recommended waiver of 5.0 per cent value added tax (VAT) on commission of indenting agents to facilitate their repatriation of foreign currency to Bangladesh.

He recently sent a demy official (DO) letter to Finance Minister A H M Mustafa Kamal, requesting him to consider the issue.

In the letter, Mr Mannan said the indentors have been recognised as ‘service exporters’ by the Ministry of Commerce for earning foreign currency.

As per the existing law, no VAT is applicable on the country’s exporters to help them stay competitive in the international market.

Earlier, the commerce minister also sent a letter to the finance minister with the same request.

Their recommendations came following demand of the Bangladesh Indenting Agents Association (BIAA) after imposition of 5.0 per cent VAT on them in the budget for fiscal year (FY) 2019-20.

Requesting VAT exemption, the BIAA President Rafiqul Islam Masum, in a letter, noted the Office of Chief Controller of Imports and Exports (CCI&E) awarded the status of ‘service exporters’ to the indenting businesses on December 11, 2018.

The planning minister, in his letter, also said the indentors are the representatives of foreign exporters, and are assigned to marketing their products in Bangladesh.

They also procure quality raw materials from the international market for the country’s export-oriented industries.

The indenting agents get their commission in foreign currencies from overseas companies for working as their local agents, Mr Mannan further said.

The indentors sent their commission or royalty in formal banking channel through proceed realisation certificate (PRC).

“VAT should be withdrawn for the FY 2019-20 on commission of the indentors as service exporters,” he added.

Talking to the FE, the BIAA former president K M H Shahidul Haque said there is a stay order of the Appellate Division on a writ filed against imposition of VAT on the indenting businesses.

He said the indentors are entitled to enjoy VAT exemption on their commission as ‘service exporters’.

Last year, VAT at a rate of 15 per cent was imposed on indenting commission, which has been brought down to 5.0 per cent in FY 20, he added.

However, the indentors are not paying any VAT due to the stay order of the Appellate Division.

Considering the indentors’ contribution in foreign exchange earning, the government had withdrawn 15 percent VAT on their commission in FY 2014-15.

As a result, the indentors were highly encouraged to repatriate commission, and the volume of repatriation increased tremendously.

However, VAT on repatriated indenting commission was re-imposed in FY 2016-17.

Industry insiders said the re-imposition of VAT may create a negative impact on the indentors’ repatriation of foreign currency to the country. Some of them may prefer to keep their money abroad to avoid payment of VAT on commission.

The indentors work for overseas companies, exporters, investors and consultants as agents for marketing their goods and commodities in the country.

There are some 2,500 members registered under the BIAA. However, the number of indentors is higher, as many of the indenting agents are not members of the association

Bangladesh invents green throw-away bags from jute

As countries around the world try to cut down on throw-away plastic shopping bags, Bangladesh is hoping to cash in on an alternative: plastic-like bags made from jute, the plant fibre used to produce burlap bags, says a report of the Thomson Reuters Foundation.

Bangladesh is the world’s second biggest producer of jute after India, though the so-called “golden fibre” – named for its colour and its once-high price – has lost its sheen as demand has fallen.

Now, however, a Bangladeshi scientist has found a way to turn the fibre into low-cost biodegradable cellulose sheets that can be made into greener throw-away bags that look and feel much like plastic ones.

“The physical properties are quite similar,” said Mubarak Ahmad Khan, a scientific adviser to the state-run Bangladesh Jute Mills Corporation (BJMC) and leader of the team that developed the new ‘sonali’ – the Bengali word for golden – bags.

He said the sacks are biodegradable after three months buried in soil, and can also be recycled.

Bangladesh is now producing 2,000 of the bags a day on an experimental basis, but plans to scale up commercial production after signing an agreement last October with the British arm of a Japanese green packaging firm.

Bangladesh Prime Minister Sheikh Hasina in March urged those working on the project “to help expedite the wider usage of the golden bags” for both economic and environmental gains.

In April, the government approved about $900,000 in funding from Bangladesh’s own climate change trust fund to help pave the way for large-scale production of the bags.

“Once the project is in full swing, we hope to be able to produce the sonali bag commercially within six months,” Mamnur Rashid, the general manager of the BJMC, told the Thomson Reuters Foundation.

Bangladesh was one of the first countries to ban the use of plastic and polythene bags, in 2002, in an effort to stop them collecting in waterways and on land – though the ban has had little success.

Today more than 60 countries – from China to France – have outlawed the bags in at least some regions or cities, Khan said.

As the bans widen, more than 100 Bangladeshi and international firms are looking into using the new jute-based shopping sacks, Khan said.

“Every day I am receiving emails or phone calls from buyers from different countries,” he said, including Britain, Australia, the United States, Canada, Mexico, Japan and France.

The bag is likely to have “huge demand around the world,” said Sabuj Hossain, director of Dhaka-based export firm Eco Bangla Jute Limited.

He said his company hopes eventually to export 10 million of the bags each month.

Commercial production is expected to start near the end of the year, said Rashid of the BJMC.

Khan said that if all the jute produced in Bangladesh went to make the sacks, the country was still likely to be able to meet just a third of expected demand.

While Bangladesh’s own plastic bag ban is now almost two decades old, million of the bags are still used each year in the South Asian country because of a lack of available alternatives and limited enforcement, officials said.

Local firm to set up $200m plant to make electric vehicle

Bangladesh Auto Industries will tie up with firms from US, China, India and Italy

Jagaran Chakma

Local automobile company Bangladesh Auto Industries Ltd (BAIL) is all set to make electric vehicles from next year with an initial investment of $200 million.

The facilities, civil work and utility connection of the proposed plant on a 100-acre of land at the Mirsarai economic zone in Chattogram will be completed by December this year, Mir Masud Kabir, managing director of BAIL, told The Daily Star.

“We will install the manufacturing equipment by March next year and the manufacturing will begin in June.”

BAIL will manufacture two-wheelers, three-wheelers, sedan, hatchback and sport utility vehicle (SUV) and has plans to produce pick-ups, mini-trucks and multipurpose vehicles.

Of the planned $200 million investment, 80 percent will be sourced locally, while the rest will enter the country as a foreign direct investment


The total investment for the project will reach $1 billion within the next five years, Kabir said.

Leading local telecom service provider Mango Teleservices Ltd holds a majority share in BAIL established in November 2017.

An electric vehicle (EV) uses chemical energy stored in efficient and environment-friendly rechargeable lithium ion battery packs instead of fossil fuel to propel it.Globally, the electric car’s share in the total automobile industry is on the rise.

At the end of 2018, it stood at 4.6 percent, almost double from what it was in 2017, according to the Centre of Automotive Management (CAM), a research and consultancy institute based in Germany.

China is leading the countries in electric car use, followed by the US, Norway, Japan and the UK. By 2025, electric cars will account for one-fourth of all new registrations, according to CAM.

Within the next 25 years all fossil fuel cars would be replaced by the EVs, it said.

Kabir said foreign partners from the US, China, India and Italy will provide technical and expert support for the facility.

The plant will manufacture almost 60 percent of the component of the vehicles, including lithium battery, motor, controller, software platform, chassis and body.

Internationally acclaimed designers have designed the initial EV models for BAIL, said Kabir.

A team of the company will lead the initiative and carry out future research and development together with foreign experts, expatriate Bangladeshis and local talents, he said.

The team will also create web-based portal for co-creation and suggestion for product and ecosystem development in order to ensure inclusive and participatory environment for the nation, he said.

“BAIL products will be a national pride.”

The company will sell an SUV at Tk 25 lakh, sedan at Tk 12 lakh to Tk 15 lakh, hatchback at Tk 8 lakh or even less. The price of the motor cycles will be Tk 50,000 to Tk 1.5 lakh.

About the challenges of the project, Kabir said the market seems to be small at the moment. “But the market will continue expanding as the economy is growing at a steady pace.”

“There is huge regional and global potential as well.”

He said the EVs would cut fuel cost by 90 percent and per kilometre energy cost will be less than Tk 2.

“Customers will replace their fossil fuel-run vehicles with EVs thanks to lower price and cheaper fuel cost and the environmental benefits.”

According to a market analysis of BAIL, annual car sales will reach two lakh units by 2025 from about 20,000 units in 2018.

The battery capacity will be 50 kilowatt hour and it will cost Tk 400 to fully charge an EV each time as per the existing electricity tariff.

“With a twenty-minute charge, our EVs can run 400km,” Kabir said, adding that the car can be charged at home with a regular connection or at a quick charging station.

Quick charging stations will be set up on the highways, at refuelling stations, parking spaces and convenient stores. There will be provision for charged battery swap too.

The battery’s lifetime will be around 10 years, he said.